Comments on: Standard Deck Primer: R/G Monsters https://www.quietspeculation.com/2014/02/standard-deck-primer-rg-monsters/ Play More, Win More, Pay Less Fri, 11 Jul 2014 06:55:18 +0000 hourly 1 By: Kenneth https://www.quietspeculation.com/2014/02/standard-deck-primer-rg-monsters/#comment-122315 Fri, 11 Jul 2014 06:55:18 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=43985#comment-122315 In reply to Mike Schuller.

I like xenagod into kalonian hydra. A12/12 hasty trampler is a nice drop at any point in the game. As for cost & devotion, if you can’t ramp out a 5 drop by turn 4 at the latest in rg, that’s sad. I think bte & ntkthos are necessary. I’ve had quite a few games where I’m dropping a huge mistcutter on turn 2 or 3. I also like bow of nylea as a one-of. Versatile, but mostly useful for deathtouch. Instants like fall of the hammer or mutant’s prey turn even an elvish mystic into an assassin

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By: Mike Schuller https://www.quietspeculation.com/2014/02/standard-deck-primer-rg-monsters/#comment-84138 Fri, 28 Feb 2014 20:40:29 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=43985#comment-84138 In reply to Mike Schuller.

Also in regards to #5, Mono Blue might be weaker than it was pre-BNG due to losing some percentage points in the Mono Black matchup due to Bile Blight.

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By: Mike Schuller https://www.quietspeculation.com/2014/02/standard-deck-primer-rg-monsters/#comment-84137 Fri, 28 Feb 2014 20:31:57 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=43985#comment-84137 In reply to Evan.

I have actually been leaning in the direction of 3 Courser as well. Flames is definitely one of the looser cards in the sideboard, but I consider Wasteland Viper to be filling the role of Shock. You typically don’t need to change many cards against aggressive decks, and there’s not really any matchup where Shock is going to be better.

1) This is a fair consideration. I was thinking that typically you only bring in Revelry against Detention Sphere decks (or fringe cases where you’ve seen cards like Whip, Pithing Needle, etc), but if some versions start playing Ephara then this would be much better. I suppose you could come up with a sideboarding plan where you bring it in against Thassa since it can also hit Bident.

2) What’s the cut?

3) I wouldn’t really want Bow over any other card, especially against Mono Blue. If Burn becomes a larger part of the metagame then it could be worth consideration.

4) I mentioned this in the article, but I prefer to err a bit on the side of being able to cast spells. This deck cares very much about curving out with accelerant -> fatty -> fatty. In the non- mono black non-UW control matchups, you are behind in the games where you don’t have an accelerant. So many cards in the deck help mitigate the downsides of flooding such as Temples, overload, fusing Flesh, and activating monstrous. On the flip side, if you miss your fourth mana you will just be twiddling your thumbs.

5) I’ve seen others mention that mono blue is a bad matchup, but I’m not sure what they’re doing wrong because I’ve always found it very favorable, even pre-board. The games you lose can be due to a fast Cloudfin Raptor draw, a fast Master of Waves that you can’t Polukranos/Mortars, or you lose a close race against Thassa. The first two can typically be contained by limiting devotion/damage with Mortars/Domri/etc, and like I mentioned above it’s possible that Unravel the Aether can help with the Thassa games.

6) The problem with Armed/Dangerous is that you have to already be ahead in order to cast it. Flesh/Blood can act as a simple Doom Blade while you are grappling for board presence.

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By: Evan https://www.quietspeculation.com/2014/02/standard-deck-primer-rg-monsters/#comment-84133 Fri, 28 Feb 2014 19:46:24 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=43985#comment-84133 I love your insight on Plummit, Chandra, Garruk, and Xenagod. However, I think 3 courser is the right amount. I still think I like shock over flames, and wasteland viper is cute but can’t block fliers

1) What are your thoughts on Unravel the Aether vs. Destructive revelry? To me, being able to hit gods seems better than dealing 2, which is more necessary for an aggro deck to not miss a beat.

2) Boon satyr seems more necessary when you are going with the flesh build, where you may want some redundancy with Ghor-Clan

3) How about a Bow of Nylea in the sideboard? It seems strong against burn, where it can kill phoenixes and gain you 3 life a turn. Maybe against Mono U where they have small fliers. Also, you can monstrous polukranos after you attack so it could take part of wasteland viper’s role

4) Is 8 mana guys and 24 land too many? I’ve seen many builds where it’s been 7 mana guys or 23 lands.

5) Is mono blue enough of a matchup problem to run 1 of the Mistcutter main?

6) How do you feel about Armed//Dangerous for the aggro mirror? Stronger but riskier than flesh/blood

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By: Mike Schuller https://www.quietspeculation.com/2014/02/standard-deck-primer-rg-monsters/#comment-84130 Fri, 28 Feb 2014 18:40:01 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=43985#comment-84130 In reply to Stu.

It’s certainly possible that you are right, since it is an incredible card. However, I believe that there’s an argument to be made for 2 or 3 copies, since it’s poor in multiples.

It’s also somewhat weaker in this particular build, since the emphasis is on Rampager and Flesh//Blood which greatly benefit from hidden information.

What would you cut for Coursers and/or black cards?

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By: Mike Schuller https://www.quietspeculation.com/2014/02/standard-deck-primer-rg-monsters/#comment-84129 Fri, 28 Feb 2014 18:38:27 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=43985#comment-84129 In reply to Justin.

I haven’t ran into many Obzedats lately, but if they’re running that instead of Blood Baron you can take out Mortars and increase your threat density. There are plenty of cards in the deck that can tangle with Obzedat or ignore it completely.

Whip could be problematic in some games, but if they are running other targets for Destructive Revelry you can hedge against it.

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By: Mike Schuller https://www.quietspeculation.com/2014/02/standard-deck-primer-rg-monsters/#comment-84128 Fri, 28 Feb 2014 18:35:56 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=43985#comment-84128 In reply to Search.

It’s possible that you are right, but I believe that Xenagod makes you win the games you are already going to win even harder and does not do much in games where you need help. It is fantastic to attack for 10 with Polukranos and 8 with Stormbreath, sure, but it’s also fantastic to attack for 5 and 4 with them. Additionally, my argument is that you are likely winning any game where you have 7 devotion on the board anyway, since this deck’s permanents tend to be better than other decks’ permanents.

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By: Search https://www.quietspeculation.com/2014/02/standard-deck-primer-rg-monsters/#comment-84124 Fri, 28 Feb 2014 18:19:29 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=43985#comment-84124 I think you are dead wrong on Xenagod. Once resolved, practically all of your threats are relevant this turn, not next turn.

2/2 tokens swing for 4, he synergizes well with Domri’s -2 (in 2nd main), a 10/10 hasty polukranos is incredible, and having 5 devotion’s worth of other permanents resolved isn’t exactly incredibly unlikely in a deck running polukranos, stormbreath, caryatid, and two mana symbol walkers.

There are plenty of times where you could have a domri and a caryatid down. If Xenagos is also on the board, then you can resolve a stormbreath and swing for 14 (8 flying, 6 indestructible) or resolve a polukranos and swing for 16.

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By: Justin https://www.quietspeculation.com/2014/02/standard-deck-primer-rg-monsters/#comment-84123 Fri, 28 Feb 2014 18:08:08 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=43985#comment-84123 Obzedat can also be a problem if your opening isn’t fast enough – it’s big enough to make blocking awkward and pretty good in a race. Add in the 1-of whip that is popular in Ester midrange builds and it’s very hard to beat.

I’ve been trying the June build lately – it probably has an edge in the mirror but doesn’t look better elsewhere…

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By: Stu https://www.quietspeculation.com/2014/02/standard-deck-primer-rg-monsters/#comment-84108 Fri, 28 Feb 2014 15:26:06 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=43985#comment-84108 Any version of this deck not playing 4 Courser is probably not very good. Also, the black cards up the power-level of the deck, not weaken it.

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