Comments on: Death’s Shadow: Analysis, Implications, Potential

By: Jordan Boisvert

Jordan Boisvert — Wed, 08 Mar 2017 03:31:20 +0000

In reply to Nat Crosman. Thanks for the comment Nat! See you around if you ever come back.

By: Nat Crosman

Nat Crosman — Mon, 06 Mar 2017 03:54:29 +0000

In reply to Nat Crosman. Whoops, read "interactive" for "reactive" above.

By: Nat Crosman

Nat Crosman — Mon, 06 Mar 2017 03:52:18 +0000

Your perspective of the deck’s strengths as deriving from a strong proactive game plan plus a strong reactive game plan plus good consistency is the most succinct and trenchant analysis of this build I’ve read. I enjoy that this kind of thought process is much more useful than a case-by-case type analysis, e.g. “It’s better than Jund because it’s faster so therefore it’s better against Tron” which is where most commentators I’ve read have been going. Your article also gives me a tool to consider any other deck through the same lens, so many thanks for the framework.

It was nice to meet you a few weeks ago in Boston, best of luck to you.

By: Jordan Boisvert

Jordan Boisvert — Sun, 05 Mar 2017 16:48:34 +0000

In reply to KeanuFeeds. That doesn't make his deck bad. Everyone can have a crummy run. Of course, everyone can also run hot. He did take 4th at the Classic though, which gives me hope for Ryan's list. Only time will tell if he got unlucky early or just lucky later.

By: KeanuFeeds

KeanuFeeds — Sat, 04 Mar 2017 23:25:28 +0000

FYI, Ryan Overturf X/3 dropped out of the main event with the same deck too.

By: Jordan Boisvert

Jordan Boisvert — Sat, 04 Mar 2017 03:32:18 +0000

In reply to Adam Juarez. Snap-Traverse is pretty similar to Command in the BUG decks. But Command and LTLH might be just better at this. I'll have to put in more reps to be sure.

By: Jordan Boisvert

Jordan Boisvert — Sat, 04 Mar 2017 03:23:10 +0000

In reply to William Sabato. I don't think it's better than Goyf, and that's been legal for a long time. As always, bans will come down to metagame share and win percentage, since there's no fear of DSJ ending a crazy amount of games before turn four. I think it's premature to think about these factors without more numbers.

By: Jordan Boisvert

Jordan Boisvert — Sat, 04 Mar 2017 03:19:55 +0000

In reply to Bat Hickey.

This was my big fear with going blue—are the options from a white splash in Jund as effective? I’d say in the short-term, Jund is definitely better positioned. Once the deck catches on a bit more, people learn to get around TBR, and players start sleeving up natural predators to Death’s Shadow, Snap (for the mirror/removal decks) and Denial (for combo/removal decks) may be worth more exploration.

You can actually read more about these cards in the article 😎

By: Jordan Boisvert

Jordan Boisvert — Sat, 04 Mar 2017 03:17:33 +0000

In reply to Zach Stackhouse. Go for it! Modern is all about playing your favorite strategy. But I don't love Living End's odds against a deck with 8 Thoughtseizes, mainboard Street Wraiths, creatures that dwarf yours without going wide, and Surgicals in the side.... Remember that DS changes his p/t when you steal him, too.

By: Jordan Boisvert

Jordan Boisvert — Sat, 04 Mar 2017 03:15:02 +0000

In reply to Speedy Jim. I can see cutting a Denial, but Scour has never been great for enabling delirium on its own in my experience. Will have to test a lot more before drawing more conclusions.

By: Adam Juarez

Adam Juarez — Fri, 03 Mar 2017 23:03:40 +0000

Ryan Overturf’s list looks similar to a list I ran for a second place finish in a pptq, it does still have a massive weakness to removal heavy decks. Death’s Shadow Jund uses a rebuy mechanic that shores up that problem. I feel like a mix of Grixis Death’s Shadow and Jund is a way to go, with spells like K Command and Lili last hope this should be a great list.

By: William Sabato

William Sabato — Fri, 03 Mar 2017 22:18:17 +0000

Are you worried that death shadow might be too good? I dont advocate a ban, its far too early to tell, but I feel like it wont be hard to justify a ban. I mean, wizards did ban G-probe largely due to death shadow in particular, and if the deck has gotten more powerful, I feel like their sentiments against it will remain

By: Bat Hickey

Bat Hickey — Fri, 03 Mar 2017 22:08:04 +0000

Blue offers basically nothing in your list that couldn’t be done better with white (or just going deeper into green–which then opens up a ton of other options main and post-board. Souls, path, apostle’s blessing, stony silence, silence itself even seems like a better sideboard card than ceremonious rejection.

Why Blue? Day’s undoing?

By: Zach Stackhouse

Zach Stackhouse — Fri, 03 Mar 2017 21:25:33 +0000

I think the more saavy reaction to the reveal of Fatal Push was how it was ineffective against ramp and delve creatures, and so it was not an auto-4 of in decks with black. This deck may change that. Conversely…it seems like go-wide strategies that are not super vulnerable to discard would be effective, like Affinity and Elves. Living End makes sense as a counterpick as well – maindeck Kari Zev’s expertise throws a giant death shadow back at the opponent or let’s you play a living end to wipe the board while attacking the shadow deck’s 3-4 color manabase.

Basically I just want to play living end.

By: Speedy Jim

Speedy Jim — Fri, 03 Mar 2017 21:13:44 +0000

Have you considered cutting 1 snapcaster, 1 fatal push and 1 or 2 stubborn denial for 4x thought scour in your Sultai build? When you cut tarfire from the deck, you are going to less reliably reach delirium for Traverse, which is actually the biggest reason to be playing red. The addition of thought scour, to some degree remedies that. The other option is to play something like Architects of Will as a 1 or 2 of. Something that GerryT has touched upon when he pondered whether the Death’s Shadow shell can add a color other than red.

Further, when you have thought scour and snapcaster in your deck, it allows you to run more one-ofs for more specific situations. So instead of playing:
3x Denial, 1x Decay, 1x Dismember, you could instead play, 1x denial, 1x decay, 1x dismember, 1x dispel, 1x collective brutality… or something along those lines.

Finally, thought scour allows you to run 18 or (maybe) even 17 lands because you essentially will have 12 cantrips in the deck instead of the 8 that the original shell provides.