Comments on: Insider: A Moral Dilemma https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/ Play More, Win More, Pay Less Tue, 18 Jan 2022 02:03:07 +0000 hourly 1 By: pi https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/#comment-1904181 Fri, 01 Sep 2017 15:14:36 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=79869#comment-1904181 In reply to phyrexian trader.

(Note: the above comment was just approved as I discovered it was hanging in limbo; I forgot to switch back to my writer account).

1. I agree. I would argue that his expectation was strange to start with though. I certainly think that communication problems work both ways, however there were no signals that we had a misunderstanding until things went wrong. I could’ve certainly tried to communicate more clearly and did in fact try multiple times to explain my position, to which he did not respond (beyond unfriending me).

3. I was not in a position to call him as I was just making a toilet visit at the time, about 5 meters away from the seller. I certainly think that calling would’ve helped with the perception, but it was not a posibility at that point. It also didn’t help that I felt that I couldn’t share the seller’s story.

Unfortunately I received the signal of miscommunication at a point when there was little I could do about it.

I don’t believe it’s unfair to make a personal story public; writers would have very little to write about if so. If he was open to discuss I would’ve never written about it in the first place but instead would’ve tried to resolve it with him. I would still be.

By closing the dialog he’s just as guilty of making things worse. I believe that for me writing about it helped me deal with it and that the story has benefits for my readers. I don’t think there’s a big risk of him being identified and an even smaller chance of such a witch burning. Now you could certainly argue that anything that makes things worse is something to be avoided, I am however still human.

You make some valid points and possibly I could’ve reflected more on the content of the article or my actions. In many ways this has been a learning experience for me.

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By: phyrexian trader https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/#comment-1858668 Wed, 29 Mar 2017 10:05:55 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=79869#comment-1858668 Just a reminder that we only hear one side of the story.

it’s pretty clear you are convinced about your side of the story and how you presented yourself to the other buyer.

BUT it’s clearly that your intended image didn’t successfully reached the other buyer.

To learn something from this, both for you and for us, it would be better to reflect on your own actions.

You focus too much on the other guy.

Your conclusion is: I have more integrity than the other guy.

You can’t change his attitude, but you can focus on what you can do in the future to prevent this.

1. you are convinced about your own clear communication towards him, but he clearly didn’t got that. Maybe you was not clear enough to check if he really understand your intentions? It seems he had the impression that things were going to happen like he had planned.

Lesson: always check if the other clearly understands you.

3. you texted him during the visit, and you got your first signal something was wrong in his perception. It’s a classic one (people have wrong perception in message).

Do you think that calling him at that point could have saved you both from further frustrations?

Lesson: identify signals of miscommunication and act to prevent escalation.

and as final conclusion:

It’s unfair to make a personal story public and not giving the other person a change to defend himself. If he ever finds out, you will have bigger problems with him.

You don’t give a name, but enough details that someone may be able to identify him. You don’t want to be responsible for an online witch burning (I don’t think this will happen, but things can escalate quickly).

So you are making things worse in my eyes.

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By: Niels Rietkerk https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/#comment-1857187 Fri, 24 Mar 2017 17:56:01 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=79869#comment-1857187 In reply to Christopher Martin.

I understand what you’re getting at, but I know very few who would have a chance of running into him as most are very casual players and he lives fairly far away. I wouldn’t mind telling the others, but I doubt it’ll matter. I’m fine leaving it at this.

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By: Christopher Martin https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/#comment-1857168 Fri, 24 Mar 2017 16:49:26 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=79869#comment-1857168 In reply to Niels Rietkerk.

Expose was a strong term no doubt. Your article fired me up to start the morning haha but in all seriousness without using the word expose it may be prudent at least to warn your close-knit group. Word doesn’t have to spread from you for it to spread at all. It’s important to keep people like this at bay because they give the community a poor reflection. I personally have always felt the Magic community is one of the more honest and friendly in the “Gaming” world.

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By: Niels Rietkerk https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/#comment-1857160 Fri, 24 Mar 2017 15:50:51 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=79869#comment-1857160 In reply to Matthew Lewis.

Thanks!

In Dutch we say “zoals de waard is vertrouwd hij zijn gasten”, which (literally) translates to “the way the innkeeper is, is how he trusts his guests”, meaning something similar to how “it takes one to know one” is used when someone accuses you of something. This is one of the first things I thought of.

During our pre-buy chat I also got the impression that he considered himself the more established buyer and that “small fry” like myself should not get in the way. Which I politely ignored at first and I then said that he was probably underestimating my buying power. I don’t think I convinced him then, but perhaps I have now.

To most on the Dutch scene I am a relatively unknown player because I tend to aim internationally. Most of the shop owners know me, but few of the backpack traders. I’m ok with that, I generally prefer the underdog position.

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By: Niels Rietkerk https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/#comment-1857157 Fri, 24 Mar 2017 15:38:50 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=79869#comment-1857157 In reply to q ed2.

Euri. Pleuros. Pegels. Doekoe if you want to go with street slang. We have our own words.

Doesn’t really matter though. At least in (American) English it makes sense as an expression. I may or may not use “bucks” when speaking English, depends on the context and audience. As slang it’s less likely that non-native speakers have picked up on it, but it’s far more common than most slang, almost to the point that it could be considered part of the language.

At the very least it would be safe for David to assume that I know what he means.

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By: Matthew Lewis https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/#comment-1857156 Fri, 24 Mar 2017 15:38:46 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=79869#comment-1857156 Great article! It’s interesting that the other collector assumed the worst about you. It speaks to their perspective on things, in that they were proposing to ‘collude’ around the collection, but when that didn’t work out felt they must have been cheated in some way.

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By: q ed2 https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/#comment-1857147 Fri, 24 Mar 2017 15:07:42 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=79869#comment-1857147 In reply to David Schumann.

Do they even call them “bucks” when the currency isn’t USD?

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By: Niels Rietkerk https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/#comment-1857102 Fri, 24 Mar 2017 12:38:03 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=79869#comment-1857102 In reply to David Schumann.

Thanks, it definitely is.

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By: Niels Rietkerk https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/#comment-1857101 Fri, 24 Mar 2017 12:36:58 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=79869#comment-1857101 In reply to Christopher Martin.

I don’t really like to expose people as that may easily backfire. He makes assumptions about the way I was thinking and concludes I tried to screw him over, when I would expose him I would basically also assume I can read his mind. He was definitely proposing shady practices, but, I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt in regard to whether he realized (though I do suspect that he did I can’t be sure).

I definitely feel like I did the right thing, no concerns there. Just don’t like making enemies 😉

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By: Niels Rietkerk https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/#comment-1857099 Fri, 24 Mar 2017 12:26:05 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=79869#comment-1857099 In reply to Nikolas Mohammed.

I think giving them a heads up on the ref-check is fine. I even think it’s ok to expres interest in part of a collection, as long as you’re clear on that you’re both still interested in it. What goes too far is to try to manipulate the price.

The only thing I am concerned about it that he might try to get back at me in some way. There aren’t too many high end collectors in The Netherlands, I am bound to run into people he knows. I’m sure he gives his own twist to it when he tells them this story.

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By: David Schumann https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/#comment-1857098 Fri, 24 Mar 2017 12:21:16 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=79869#comment-1857098 Agreed. Being able to look yourself in the eye every morning is a lot more important than making a few quick bucks.

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By: Christopher Martin https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/#comment-1857095 Fri, 24 Mar 2017 12:05:51 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=79869#comment-1857095 Whoever the person is that was trying to do the shady practices is doing you the favor by blocking you. Those people are not welcome in this community (or any community for that matter). I would honestly consider exposing that person to other larger Magic collectors to warn them about the possibly of his/her actions. Don’t feel bad – it sounds to me like you did the right thing.

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By: Nikolas Mohammed https://www.quietspeculation.com/2017/03/insider-a-moral-dilemma/#comment-1857091 Fri, 24 Mar 2017 11:14:20 +0000 http://www.quietspeculation.com/?p=79869#comment-1857091 Your story makes me think twice about communicating with other potential buyers. As if finding and buying collections was not already challenging enough. I would not have lied either and would just assume the other buyer exists for the purpose of testing your patience (we are all blessed with these types of people and encounters) and carry on the best you know how.

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