Yep, like I said, Prodder is worse than Raider. But neither is playable. As always, we’ll see if I’m wrong!

Also not sure about what you mean that Raider’s potential is higher? Tracker can come down and immediately produce two clues with a fetchland (or more if you have been keeping fetches in play without cracking them), whereas Raider will always only draw you one card max in that turn cycle. Opponents can then untap and cast Verdict or what have you and the advantage gained from Tracker remains. Plus, Tracker grows larger with every fetch cracked! It seems to me that TT’s ceiling is significantly higher.

You’re not being fair with Tracker. It’s still a three-drop even if maximum value in removal matchups is extracted by waiting a turn (something very feasible in said matchups). And you don’t need to pay for clues right away. Mana spread out over multiple turns makes a world of difference in terms of playability; just look at Lingering Souls, or at the playability of Tracker itself.

Hmmmm… maybe you have some valid points. I think comparing it with Sin Proder is very unfair. Prodder triggers on upkeep, and if it is a good card or a land the prodder will never draw them. Land, Bolt, Push etc will be a no go. Raider draws you card at EOT, witch means you can rigg it if the oponents taips out. Trading resources is a game BGX does very well.

Comparing Raider with tracker it also not the same. Tracker is usualy a 4 drop, because you need to follow it up with a land (fetchland preferably.) Tracker also needs mana to activate, while Raider has a hiegher potensial. I assume Raider will have a bigger variation though. Tracker is usually quite safe unless you need the tempo.

You point about a crowded 3 slot is very valid though. Traditionally Dark Confidant is paired with Kitchen Finks for the lifegain. We are still unsure how the Liliana situation will be (3-1 between and 4-3 maybe). I can picture a situation where Raider Will be good though.

I know this article could use an update (and I have one in the works); I linked to it because all the points I made there translate to my opinion of Ruin Raider. If you read the article you’ll see that Confidant fulfills the “Ends the Game If Unanswered” condition. You could argue that Raider does, too, but Raider costs 3; all creatures in the linked article in that section cost only 2. So the benchmark for “Ends the Game If Unanswered” creatures to see play is a CMC of 2, which Raider fails. Boltable 3-drops still need to cast a spell on resolution to see Modern play. Tracker is a good example of a “fixed” Ruin Raider; it comes down and players can rush out a land immediately to get a clue, before opponents have a window to remove it. Raider gives opponents a window.

Don’t forget the new ‘walker rule—the curve you suggested becomes much stronger if either Liliana comes down on the turn three spot. There’s no way BGx decks play Raider over more Lilis in their extra spots.

Haven’t seen this Sergio movie. All my references refer to things that, you know, I am at least aware of! But again, Ruin Raider doesn’t really deserve much consideration IMO; while marginally better than Sin Prodder, it’s got the same (literal) trappings. Hopefully this post better explained why.

All your points can be leveled against Dark Confidant, and he is stil a good creature in modern. (2. place grand Prix Burmingham 12-13 August 17.) In fact you even have him on the list of playable creatures in the text you linked as an argument. Also, the premisses for you bechmark creature playabilaty got weakened with the printing of Fatal Push. Jumping through hoops to dodge bolt is no good if you don’t dodge fatal push. To make things vorse path to exile is in the mix as well. Path, Bolt and Push are played 33% 24% and 18% respectavly.

I feel like your argumentation is a very bad shorthand for not evaluating Ruin Raider.

Obviusly you would probably not play Ruin Raider over Dark Confidant. It will mostly supply Dark Confidant 5 to 8. What is notable is that there are senarioes where Ruin Raider will be better then Dark Confidant. The following sequence – Turn 1 Discardspell, Turn 2 Tarmogoyf, opponents taps out and then Tarmogoyf attacks followed by playing Ruin Raider you are garanteed a card. With how proficient BGX decks are at grinding this is a perfect senario. They have to trade one card to kill Ruin Raider and Ruin Raider has already replaced himself. They could kill Tarmogoyf instead to deny an attacker if you have a blocker. However this might be a falecy since removal from the Ruin Raider player can easy clear the way to attack with him. (Bolt, Path, Push, Dreadbore, Terminate, Abrupt Deckay, Malestorm Pulse, either Liliana, etch.) It is much harder to sett up senarioes where you are garanteed a card with dark confidant.

Dismiss Ruin Raider at your own peril. But not having him be part of the conversation pushes this article in theritory of being very generic. You are two theerds of the way of quoting a Sergio Leone (or Jee-woon Kim) film. You could just called your ‘Niche’ section ‘The Weird’, come full circle with the references, and talked about Ruin Raider there. As always, keep up the good work.

I’m the first to admit Rogues isn’t remotely competitive; just check out my linked article. As for Temur Delver, I’ve had a good deal of success with it myself, and it Top 8’d a GP. Both Rogues and TD are decks I’ve written a fair bit about on this site.

The reason I mentioned Tracker is to address a personal gripe I have with this Pirate direction, as much as I love it otherwise; a tribe I have an affinity for isn’t getting as much love as it usually does (which is already not much). There are plenty of other cards spoiled so far that slot into unplayable decks, but I didn’t think it would be of use to anyone for me to mention them.

Has Rogues tribal ever posted an impressive result? How about Temur Delver?

Come on man, I thought we were a bit casual around here.

None I haven’t written: http://quietspeculation.com/whats-goyf-benchmark-creature-playability-modern/

Very easy to kill Raider for one mana before it gets to cast a spell on the end step.

Thanks Tim 😀

I can see painlessly running up to 6. LotV is a serious candidate for best card in Modern in my book; it’s insane against fair decks, control decks, and combo decks alike. With the rules change, that one’s pretty much a shoe-in at 4, and then it comes down to how many Hopes they want. 2 very well might be the right number, and I bet it’s even correct to restructure the deck’s curve to accommodate those six three-drops.

This is super not-a-deck. Always amazed when people bring it up as an example of something that does well from time to time, or in the hands of an experienced pilot. It’s literally a worse Zoo which is why it has never in Modern’s history, to my knowledge, posted an impressive result (GP/Open/Classic Top 16). Would love to be proven wrong on this though.

All that said these cards do seem fine there. There are plenty of ways to improve that deck though, like splashing red for Moon.